The Happiness Lab with Dr. Laurie Santos

In recent years, we've heard a lot of unsettling news about the loneliness epidemic and the dangers of social isolation. But could all this talk about loneliness paradoxically be making the problem... worse?
Dr. Laurie unpacks what we get wrong about loneliness. Along the way, she speaks with historian Fay Bound-Alberti about why loneliness, as we think of it today, is a surprisingly modern phenomenon. Psychologist Micaela Rodriguez explains why we often confuse loneliness with being alone — and why learning to enjoy solitude can actually make us less lonely. And writer Emma Gannon shares practical tips for embracing the joy of your own company.
Laurie discovers why spending time alone is a skill, and how getting better at it can help us regulate our emotions, spark creativity, and strengthen our connections with others.
Experts Mentioned:
Vivek Murthy, 19th and 21st Surgeon General of the United States
Fay Bound-Alberti, Professor of Modern History at King’s College London
Micaela Rodriguez, Assistant Professor of Psychology at Yale University
Emma Gannon, author, blogger, and podcaster
Matthew Killingsworth, Senior Fellow at The Wharton School, University of Pennsylvania
Timothy Wilson, Professor Emeritus of Psychology at the University of Virginia
Scott Campbell, Professor of Mediated Communication at The Ohio State University
Julia Cameron, author, poet, songwriter, filmmaker, and playwright
Blaise Pascal, 17th-century French philosopher
Resources Mentioned:
“Our Epidemic of Loneliness and Isolation: The U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory on the Healing Effects of Social Connection and Community,” by Office of the Surgeon General (2023)
“Social connection linked to improved health and reduced risk of early death,” by World Health Organization Media Team (2025)
A Biography of Loneliness: The History of an Emotion, by Fay Bound-Alberti (2019)
“Just think: The challenges of the disengaged mind,” by Timothy Wilson, David Reinhard, Erin Westgate, Daniel Gilbert, Nicole Ellerbeck, Cheryl Hahn, Casey Brown, and Adi Shaked (Science, 2014)
“How people think about being alone shapes their experience of loneliness,” by Micaela Rodriguez, Kathryn E. Schertz, and Ethan Kross (Nature Communications, 2025)
“From ‘isolation’ to ‘me-time’: Linguistic shifts enhance solitary experiences,” by Micaela Rodriguez and Scott Campbell (Cognition and Emotion, 2025)
“Solitude can be good—If you see it as such: Reappraisal helps lonely people experience solitude more positively,” by Micaela Rodriguez, Samuel Pratt, Benjamin W. Bellet, and Richard J. McNally (Journal of Personality, 2023)
A Creative Compass: Finding Your Way to a Creative Life, by Emma Gannon (2026)
“A love letter to solitude,” by Emma Gannon (The Hyphen, 2025)
“‘Don’t you have friends to go with?’: the stigma and joy of a table for one,” by Emma Gannon (The Guardian, 2026)
The Artist’s Way, by Julia Cameron (1992)
Related Episodes:
“Beat Your Isolation Loneliness”
“Fighting that "Meh" Feeling of Languishing”
“Emotions Are Data…So Listen to Them”
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What would it take to make you happier? A raise? A promotion? Getting into your dream school? Winning the lottery? It turns out that we’re surprisingly bad at predicting how these events will actually make us feel. When they do make us happier, research shows that the highs won’t last as long as we expect. The good news is that the lows won't last as long as we expect either. We're just as bad at predicting how life's setbacks will affect us.
Dr. Laurie speaks with Harvard psychologist Daniel Gilbert about why our minds exaggerate the emotional impact of life’s biggest events. She also hears from psychotherapist Clay Cockrell about why extreme wealth often comes with misery, and from writer Rafaella Gunz and Army veteran J.R. Martinez about their journeys toward happiness and meaning after experiences they once thought would ruin their lives.
Experts Mentioned:
Daniel Gilbert, Professor of Psychology at Harvard University
Clay Cockrell, Licensed Clinical Social Worker and Psychotherapist
Daniel Kahneman, Professor of Psychology, Emeritus, and Professor of Psychology and Public Affairs, Emeritus at Princeton University
Angus Deaton, Professor of International Affairs, Emeritus, and Professor of Economics and International Affairs, Emeritus at Princeton University
Matthew Killingsworth, Senior Fellow at The Wharton School, University of Pennsylvania
Rafaella Gunz, writer and social worker
J.R. Martinez, Army veteran, actor, author, and podcast host
Resources Mentioned:
“Billie Bob’s (Mis) Fortune,” by Steve McViker (Houston Press, 2000)
“The How of Happiness: A New Approach to Getting the Life You Want,” by Sonja Lyubomirsky (2007)
“High income improves evaluation of life but not emotional well-being,” by Daniel Kahneman and Angus Deaton (Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 2010)
“Experienced well-being rises with income, even above $75,000 per year,” by Matthew Killingsworth (Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 2023)
“Income and emotional well-being: a conflict resolved,” by Matthew Killingsworth, Daniel Kahneman, and Barbara Mellers (Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 2023)
Stumbling on Happiness, by Daniel Gilbert (2006)
“Immune neglect: a source of durability bias in affective forecasting,” by Daniel Gilbert, Elizabeth Pinel, Timothy Wilson, Stephen Blumberg, and Thalia Wheatley (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 1998)
“Affective forecasting: Why can't people predict their emotions?,” by Peter Ayton, Alice Pott, and Najat Elwakili (Thinking & Reasoning, 2007)
“Anticipated versus actual reaction to HIV test results,” by Elaine Sieff, Robyn Dawes, and George Lowenstein (The American Journal of Psychology, 1999)
Well-Being: Foundations of Hedonic Psychology, by Daniel Kahneman, Edward Diener, and Norbert Schwartz (1999)
“Getting Herpes Was a Gift,” by Rafaella Gunz (Ravishly, 2016)
“The impact bias is alive and well,” by Timothy Wilson and Daniel Gilbert (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 2013)
Full of Heart: My Story of Survival, Strength, and Spirit, by J.R. Martinez with Alexandra Rockey Fleming (2012)
Related Episodes:
“Why We Sabotage Our Future Selves”
“Why the ‘Good Enough’ Relationship Beats the ‘Perfect Partner’”
“Working Your Way to Happiness”
“Why Nostalgia Ain’t So Rosy”
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Men today are spending less time with friends, and many have no close friendships at all. Research shows that this lack of social connection can lead to serious long-term consequences for men's mental and physical health. The answer isn’t just more social interaction. Guys need something deeper: bromance.
Dr. Laurie speaks with actor, director, and author Andrew McCarthy about his book, Who Needs Friends: An Unscientific Examination of Male Friendship Across America, and what he learned after reconnecting with the men who shaped his life. She also talks with Harvard behavioral scientist Todd Rogers about why sports fandom can be a surprisingly powerful way for men to build deeper relationships.
Experts Mentioned:
Andrew McCarthy, actor, director, and author
Todd Rogers, Professor of Public Policy at Harvard Kennedy School
Julianne Holt-Lunstad, Professor of Psychology and Neuroscience and Director of the Social Connection & Health Lab at Brigham Young University
Michael Norton, Professor of Business Administration at Harvard Business School
Sara Algoe, Professor of Psychology at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
Resources Mentioned:
Who Needs Friends: An Unscientific Examination of Male Friendship Across America, by Andrew McCarthy (2026)
The Fandom and Social Connection Initiative
Harvard Study of Adult Development
The Ritual Effect: The Transformative Power of Our Everyday Actions, by Michael Norton (2024)
“Positive Interpersonal Processes,” by Sara Algoe (Current Directions in Psychological Science, 2019)
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Most of us default to small talk. It's polite, familiar, and feels like the safest way to start a conversation. But it may also be one of the biggest barriers to genuine connection.
Dr. Laurie speaks with author and metal-health advocate Claire Eastham about her month-long experiment replacing small talk with deeper conversations while living with social anxiety. She also chats with psychologist Nicholas Epley about why going deeper often scares us, what research reveals about opening up, and what happens when you tell a stranger about the last time you cried.
Experts Mentioned:
Claire Eastham, author, blogger, and mental-health advocate
Nicholas Epley, Professor of Behavioral Science and Faculty Director of the Roman Family Center for Decision Research at the University of Chicago Booth School of Business
Arthur Aron, Professor of Psychology at the State University of New York at Stony Brook
Elaine Aron, psychologist and author
Resources Mentioned:
We're All Mad Here: The No-Nonsense Guide to Living with Social Anxiety, by Claire Eastham (2016)
A Little More Social: How Small Choices Create Unexpected Happiness, Health, and Connection, by Nicholas Epley (2026)
“The Experimental Generation of Interpersonal Closeness: A Procedure and Some Preliminary Findings,” by Arthur Aron, Edward Melinat, Elaine Aron, Robert Darrin Vallone, and Renee Bator (Personality and Social Psychology Bulletin, 1997)
Related Episodes:
“The Surprising Case for Oversharing”
“Make Vulnerability Your Superpower (with NBA Star Kevin Love)”
“Harnessing People Around us to Feel Happier (Live with Ethan Kross)”
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In this special live episode, Dr. Laurie takes the stage at Dartmouth College for a conversation with happiness historian Darrin McMahon.
Together, they break down some of the biggest misconceptions about happiness in modern life, discuss the most effective (and often counterintuitive) ways to improve our wellbeing, and explore how smartphones, AI, and other new technologies may shape happiness in the years ahead.
Experts Mentioned:
Darrin McMahon, Professor of History at Dartmouth College
Martin Seligman, Professor of Psychology and Director of the Positive Psychology Center at the University of Pennsylvania
Lorraine Siggins, Director Emeritus of Mental Health and Counseling for Students at Yale Health
Ashley Whillans, Associate Professor of Business Administration at Harvard Business School
Sonja Lyubomirsky, Professor of Psychology at the University of California, Riverside
Carey Morewedge, Chair of the Marketing Department at Boston University’s Questrom School of Business
Gabriele Oettingen, Professor of Psychology at New York University and the University of Hamburg
David Blanchflower, Professor of Economics at Dartmouth College
Jean Twenge, Professor of Psychology at San Diego State University
Jonathan Haidt, Professor of Ethical Leadership and Professor of Business & Society at New York University Stern School of Business
Elizabeth Dunn, Professor of Psychology at the University of British Columbia
Manoush Zomorodi, journalist, podcast host, and author
Robert Putnam, Professor Emeritus of Public Policy at Harvard University
Kostadin Kushlev, Associate Professor of Psychology at Georgetown University
Catherine Price, journalist and author
Michael Inzlicht, Professor of Psychology at the University of Toronto, with a cross-appointment in the Rotman School of Management
Adam Smith, Scottish economist and philosopher
Erzo Luttmer, Professor of Economics at Dartmouth College
Jan-Emmanuel De Neve, Professor of Economics and Behavioural Science and Director of the Wellbeing Research Centre at the University of Oxford
Resources Mentioned:
The Descent of Man, and Selection in Relation to Sex, by Charles Darwin (1871)
“High Income Improves Evaluation of Life but Not Emotional Well-Being,” by Daniel Kahneman and Angus Deaton (Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, 2010)
“Income and Emotional Well-Being: A Conflict Resolved,” by Matthew Killingsworth, Daniel Kahneman, and Barbra Mellers
Time Smart: How to Reclaim Your Time and Live a Happier Life, by Ashley Whillans (2020)
The How of Happiness: A New Approach to Getting the Life You Want, by Sonja Lyubomirsky (2007)
The Happiness Hypothesis: Finding Modern Truth in Ancient Wisdom, by Jonathan Haidt (2006)
“Thought for Food: Imagined Consumption Reduces Actual Consumption,” by Carey K Morewedge, Young Eun Huh, and Joachim Vosgerau (Science, 2010)
Rethinking Positive Thinking: Inside the New Science of Motivation, by Gabriele Oettingen (2014)
“Declining Life Satisfaction and Happiness Among Young Adults in Six English-Speaking Countries,” by Jean Twenge and David Blanchflower (NBER Working Paper Series, 2025)
“Smartphones Reduce Smiles Between Strangers,” by Kostadin Kushlev, John Hunter, Jason Proulx, Sarah Pressman, and Elizabeth Dunn (Computers in Human Behavior, 2019)
Body Electric: The Hidden Health Costs of the Digital Age and New Science to Reclaim Your Well-Being, by Manoush Zomorodi (2026)
Bowling Alone: The Collapse and Revival of American Community, by Robert Putnam (2000)
Four Days a Week: The Life-Changing Solution for Reducing Employee Stress, Improving Well-Being, and Working Smarter, by Juliet Schor (2025)
“Do Happy People Care About Society’s Problems?,” by Kostadin Kushlev, Danielle M. Drummond, Samantha J. Heintzelman, and Ed Diener (The Journal of Positive Psychology, 2019)
“When Less Is More: Counterfactual Thinking and Satisfaction Among Olympic Medalists,” by Victoria Husted Medvec, Scott Madey, and Thomas Gilovich (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 1995)
The Theory of Moral Sentiments, by Adam Smith (1759)
“Neighbors as Negatives: Relative Earnings and Well-Being,” by Erzo Luttmer (The Quarterly Journal of Economics, 2005)
How to Break Up With Your Phone: The 30-Day Plan to Take Back Your Life, by Catherine Price (2018)
“How Does Turning to AI for Companionship Predict Loneliness and Vice Versa?”, by Dunigan Folk and Elizabeth Dunn (Psychological Science, 2026)
“Effort Feels Meaningful,” by Michael Inzlicht and Aidan Campbell (Trends in Cognitive Sciences, 2022)
Why Workplace Wellbeing Matters: The Science Behind Employee Happiness and Organizational Performance, by Jan-Emmanuel De Neve and George Ward (2025)
“Alysa Liu: ‘If I Didn’t Hit Rock Bottom, I Could Not Have Gone Up’,” by Alex Morris (Rolling Stone, 2026)
Related Episodes:
“Why the ‘Pursuit of Happiness’ Is a Bad Idea”
“What Screen Time Is Really Doing to Your Body with Manoush Zomorodi”
“What is Social Media Doing to Kids? with Dr. Jean Twenge”
“Take a Three-Day Weekend Without Losing Any Pay (with Juliet Schor)”
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