It Was What It Was : The Football History Podcast

Rob and Jonathan conclude their two-part series on football fanzines with Daniel Gray, editor of Nutmeg, host of the When Saturday Comes podcast and author of Fanzine: The Story of Football's Alternative Press.

This time they turn to the serious side of the movement. They look at how fanzines warned for years that a disaster like Hillsborough was coming, and how they fought back against the blame put on supporters, including The Sun's notorious front page. They talk about the campaigns that brought fanzines together: opposing Margaret Thatcher's ID card scheme, resisting all-seater stadiums, taking on the National Front at Leeds and helping Charlton get back to The Valley.

They also remember the joys of fanzine culture: guides to away grounds, ideas borrowed from other fanzines, and the expensive Club Call phone lines. Then they ask whether Fever Pitch, Fantasy Football, Standing Room Only and the early days of 606 took the fanzine spirit mainstream, or killed it off?

00:58 Foreshadowing Hillsborough
04:03 "It Must Be Our Fault Again"
04:41 The Fight Against ID Cards
09:34 Taking On The Sun
11:30 Standing vs All-Seater Stadiums
13:59 Fanzines Against Racism
16:38 Back to The Valley
19:32 Did Fanzines Reduce Violence?
21:43 Dissent and Contrarians
22:34 What Fanzines Got Wrong
23:42 Away Guides and Borrowed Ideas
25:42 The Club Call Rip-Off
30:04 Fanzines Go Mainstream
31:36 Standing Room Only and Fantasy Football
33:34 The Premier League and Fever Pitch
37:07 606, Then and Now
43:33 The Return of Inflatable Bananas
45:14 From Fanzines to the Hillsborough Law
46:37 Fanzines Today
49:41 Fans vs the European Super League
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Rob and Jonathan begin a two-part series on football fanzines with Daniel Gray, editor of Nutmeg, host of the When Saturday Comes podcast and author of the new book Fanzine: The Story of Football's Alternative Press.

They each share how they got started: Rob with QPR's A Kick Up the R's, Jonathan with Sunderland's A Love Supreme and Daniel with Middlesbrough's Fly Me to the Moon. They explore how DIY, punk-influenced magazines gave a voice to supporters who were demonised in the 1980s.
They look at how national titles like When Saturday Comes and Off the Ball, the Football Supporters' Association and London's Sports Pages bookshop built a sense of unity among fans. There are tales of lawsuits, angry chairmen, Brian Clough storming into a newsagent and Jonathan's run-in with the police at Southend. Finally, they reflect on how fanzines launched countless writing careers, including their own.

01:59 What Is a Fanzine?
04:04 Our First Fanzines
11:01 Giving Demonised Fans a Voice
12:57 A Million Copies Sold
16:47 Terrace Talk Begins in York
19:22 Police, Bans and Free Speech
22:53 Bradford and The City Gent
25:51 Foreshadowing Hillsborough
29:12 When Saturday Comes
32:10 Early Pioneers: The Shamrock and Foul
41:19 National Fanzines Unite Fans
43:04 Sports Pages
45:52 Arrested at Southend
48:23 Lawsuits and Angry Chairmen
50:54 A Launchpad for Writers
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Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper conclude their series on Arsène Wenger’s arrival in English football by focusing on his first full season at Arsenal (1997-98), when early doubts, draws, and a UEFA Cup exit gave way to a transformative run to the league and FA Cup double. They discuss how Wenger blended George Graham’s defensive core with signings like Petit and Overmars, and how his pioneering approach to nutrition, recovery, psychology, and scouting created a decisive late-season fitness edge—highlighted by the 1-0 win at Old Trafford that ignited a near-flawless finish. The episode relives the title-clinching 4-0 over Everton capped by Tony Adams’ iconic goal, reflects on Gary Neville’s view of the ’98 side as Arsenal’s toughest, and argues Wenger’s broader legacy in accelerating sports science, data, recruitment, and acceptance of foreign managers in the Premier League.

00:00 Wenger’s Defining Year
00:25 Setting the 97-98 Focus
02:14 New Signings Take Shape
03:28 Sizing Up the Rivals
05:48 Pints and Culture Clash
07:04 Sports Science Revolution
08:34 Psychology and Red to Blue
12:17 Scouting and Club Foundations
15:55 France Ascendant and Clairefontaine
19:28 Family Life and Early Stumbles
24:42 Neville on the 98 Arsenal
26:48 Bergkamp Magic and the Unbeaten Run
28:11 Relentless Run In
30:08 Old Trafford Turning Point
34:36 Title Clincher Everton
35:29 Adams and Bould Magic
38:40 Wenger Emotion Legacy
40:55 Cup Final Newcastle
45:05 World Cup Echoes
46:12 Changing English Football
51:27 Foreign Manager Boom
55:08 Wrap Up and Thanks
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Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper continue their Arsène Wenger series by tracing how David Dein first bonded with Wenger—via an improvised London dinner party and charades—before maintaining contact through Monaco, Antibes meetings, and mailed Arsenal VHS tapes and faxes. They cover Wenger’s post-Monaco move to Nagoya Grampus Eight, early struggles and a key interpreter change, then a turnaround to major success, which Wenger credits for reshaping his coaching and lifestyle ideas. The episode explains how Arsenal’s board eventually traveled to Japan in 1996 to recruit him amid post-Rioch chaos, public skepticism (“Arsène Who?”), and a club culture marked by drinking and addiction revelations. They discuss early dietary and training changes, Wenger retaining the famed back line, and his first signings—Vieira, Garde, and Anelka—plus the November 1996 rumour storm and Arsenal’s strong finish that set up the 1997-98 squad.
00:00 Charades With Wenger
00:34 Podcast Setup And Mystery Match
02:40 Arsenal As Gentlemen Club
05:09 Dinner Party First Impression
10:29 Arsene For Arsenal Premonition
11:35 Dein Keeps In Touch
15:05 Bayern Offer And Sacking
17:05 Japan Move And Early Struggles
20:23 Interpreter Switch Turning Point
23:27 Nagoya Success And Lessons
25:18 Secret Japan Courtship
26:20 Rioch Sacked Chaos
28:05 Arsene Who Backlash
33:09 Dressing Room Crisis
36:31 Broccoli Diet Revolution
41:42 Vieira Proves Them Wrong
43:32 Rumors Tabloid Mob
48:12 Anelka Arrival Momentum
51:22 Cool Britannia Parallels
55:05 Wrap Up Next Episode
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Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper continue their Arsène Wenger series by tracing his leap from youth coaching at Strasbourg to assistant work under Jean-Marc Guillet at Cannes, where his scouting and relentless workload stood out, before taking his first major job at Nancy with Aldo Platini as director. They discuss Wenger’s early innovations—psychologists, stretching, diet, massage and “invisible training”—and his severity, detail-obsession and frugality, alongside the loneliness and intensity he describes after defeats. Despite Nancy’s limited means and eventual relegation, Wenger earned the Monaco job in 1987, where the glamorous setting contrasted with his ascetic focus. With signings like Glenn Hoddle and Mark Hateley, he introduced advanced recovery and professionalism, won Ligue 1 in 1988, and later built teams featuring Claude Puel, while developing talents such as George Weah, Lilian Thuram and Emmanuel Petit, amid disillusionment about French football’s corruption.

00:00 Hoddle Meets Modern Training
00:47 Wenger Series Returns
01:37 Cannes Assistant Breakthrough
02:50 Motorway Scouting Story
04:08 Workaholic Coaching Routine
05:27 First Team Taste of Power
06:37 Nancy Job and Platini Link
08:03 Invisible Training Revolution
12:21 Youth Development and Frugality
15:09 Severity and Dark Obsession
19:49 Monaco Move and Glamour
23:23 Royals and Monaco Memories
25:46 Why Hoddle and Hateley Fit
26:54 Hateley Meets Wenger
27:46 Hoddle Hijacked From PSG
30:17 Training Revolution In Monaco
33:28 Beer Smoking And Culture Clash
34:46 Tactics And Touchline Temper
38:00 Monaco Glory And Marseille Shadow
43:17 Annie And Private Life
44:48 Weah Thuram Petit Talent Spotting
49:03 Highbury Encounter With Dein
52:31 Next Episode And Wrap
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